Pastor Trey interviews Lisa Thompson to learn about the art of Sabbath as an empty-nester.
welcome to the form by Jesus Podcast. This has been so fun. We are on the topic of Sabbath. We're trying to do as many convers. With our church members as possible.
Just different stages of life, different stages of maturity and different stages of the practice really leaning into. Some people are brand new at this. Other people have been doing it for a little while or forever. And I'm excited that Lisa Thompson is in the house. Welcome, Lisa Thompson.
Thanks. It's great to be here. Thank you. So tell us a little bit about yourself first, for those who maybe don't know you, like where are you from, how long you've been with our church, those sorts of things. Sure. I'm originally from the great Northeast Rhode Island specifically.
I've been back and forth to Arizona a couple times. The last time I moved back here was in 2018 and that's when I started attending Passion Creek. I got here in August and I think October was when I started. Yeah. We've been so blessed with that and I, the connection was your previous church was also in a movie theater.
Yeah, exactly. So you just had to come. I had to check it out. I love that. It was like going home that Sunday. I knew this is where I need to be. Nice. 2018, it's been so it's That's amazing. Five years. We're coming up. Five years. Five years. Yeah. That's great. And I love that you liked the movie theater cuz for so many of us, it was like the thing, it was the hurdle for people.
I thought more people would think it was. Yeah, and it was more of an obstacle for people really. Yeah. Yeah. Everywhere. Back east it was pretty natural and it didn't seem to be an issue, but I did. I loved that. I always told people We have the best, most comfortable seats. Nice. In a church. We don't anymore, but that's okay.
All right. Although we did get like the most question I saw, portable chairs we can, and so it made it a nightmare to figure out how to stack because the. The stacker that we bought was for thin chairs. Oh. And you've got these thin chairs. And so we had a custom build what we have now, which they're incredible.
They're light, they're, it was a whole thing. Like it was so funny. We were almost done with the whole church setup, in January we bought everything, which was a nightmare. And we're like, we have everything, but we don't have something to haul. The chairs. Never thought that was so funny. You have a stage, you have all of this stuff, but you don't know how to move the chairs.
But that's the situation we were in. But they're good chairs. Yes. I comparatively, but so we swapped out the popcorn, but now we at least get coffee and donuts. And donuts. Yeah. All that kind of stuff. We were not allowed of the theater, which we understand it's a business there. Yeah. But anyways, so it's fun.
It's fun to talk to people in the OG days. Yeah, it was good fun. Especially with the covid shake up and stuff. There's not as many, like a lot of people, they don't even. Yeah, our church, what it looked like before. Yeah. Yeah. It was at all. It was. I loved it there. I, but I love Passion Creek the minute I stepped in.
So where you go? I will follow. Thank you. Yeah. You have proven that. You have proven that, so I love that. Let's start talking about Sabbath now. Okay. First of all, you've been such a joy to our church. We love you so much. You've been great for our groups. You've been great just for so many, in so many ways, hospitality, and so thank you for who you are.
And thank you also for practicing the practices, like you were with us. I think 2018 was a pretty pivotal year for us, especially 2019, the beginning of 2019, we really started talking about. Yep. A lot of these practices, it was a, I almost wanna say it's like when our church began, as far as it's like a new era.
It's almost like I, I thought of the other day, maybe Passion Creek has had three different lead pastors, all of them named Trevan Camp, but. But I level different iterations and different, whatever. So one of 'em was 2019 of just really I was impacted by it in my own life in 2018.
And so then we started to talk about it. Yep. In 19, I remember. And I remember what were some of your initial thoughts even that when we're like all a sudden I emphasizing these practices I, I would probably say, where did I end up here? Where am I again? Because it looked a little different than this, the church I stepped into in October of 2018, and then these the verbiage changed a little right around practices and spiritual formation, and I'm like, am I in the right place?
Wait a minute. But I, it was familiar enough to me to understand, the context and where it was coming from, but it was also really, I think, scary for me because Have to step out of a comfort zone. Or two or three or probably a lot more than that. And it was a little nerve-wracking, but exciting at the same time.
You were so helpful for me. Cuz I have that personality where if I think I'm excited about something, everybody's excited about it. And so great that you were like, hey, Like it was a, you didn't tell me initially, but once you started seeing the payoff, you were like, by the way, Trey.
Yeah, this was, I was really skeptical at first and I thought, did I sign up for the wrong place? And so it's been helpful to remember that honestly, as we prepared for this Sabbath series with so many people not hearing some of this for the first time, recognizing there's gotta be pushback, there's gotta be fear.
Yeah, there's gotta be, why are you making, why are you doing this? Yeah, this sounds too religious or it sounds too mystical, or whatever. Yeah, I think it was the mystical part. I'm like, is this, am I, and that's where the questions in my own mind came. It was like, I need to really listen more and go into the Bible too, to make sure am I in the right place, is all I can come back to.
But it really, it all lines up everything as it should be. And Nice. It's not. It's not as crazy as I thought it was at first time. Maybe the heart of a be Acts 15. Like checking it against scriptures. That's exactly right. So what was your life like before practicing Sabbath? It's really strange.
I think my story might be a little different than a lot of others cuz I was in a really d different season of life. No children in the home. No, my life just wasn't busy. It was very easy. I work remote. So not a lot of outside intervention. Nothing spectacular. When I think about Sabbath, I often think about people at a different stage in life because they have kids and activities, and so I always thought.
I'm not sure if I really need it. If I really need all this rest that everybody's talking about. And I remember with 2019 when you started practices, we would do the 21 days of practice and that's when in Sabbath I think was initially introduced. Yes. Yeah. And I stuck my toe in the water, so to speak then.
But I don't know if I took it as seriously as I should have. Again, it, my life is so quiet. I'm like, I'm already there. Whatever. I'm getting all the rest I need. But no. When you look at it deeper, when you go a little further into it, it's the type of rest that you've always, you've been talking about these last weeks.
It's not just stopping and watching TV or mindless entertainment or whatever it is. A holy rest is, you've talked about, it's just I think of it as a, now it's a focus on God. That time I have is God's time. I'm focused on him in whatever it is I'm doing. It doesn't matter what I'm doing.
He's there at the forefront. That's good. We really found a lot of people felt that especially when the first couple weeks would just stop and then rest. And so we were intentionally like leaving out the full picture. A lot of that being like worship and scripture reading and like how do we really engage in like a Holy Sabbath?
But we realized for so many people in a different stage of life, they didn't know how to stop. So it's let's start by stopping but then lead into it. And I think that's what you're saying too, like I, I know how to stop. I can do that easily. Yeah. But like how do, what about that delight factor?
Yeah. Gratitude and really presenting it to the father, and that's the step. So I've always felt. Oh, not always. There was a time, a season in my life where I struggled at work for a while and my attitude probably wasn't where it should have been. So I did, I started a gratitude journal every morning. I got up, I wrote down three things that I was grateful for.
Awesome. I did that for about a year, and so I, I thought, oh, I have this delight thing, this gratitude down I do, I am grateful for everything and I know that, but presenting it to the father, there's the step that was missing. It was having. I call it a conversation with God about that gratitude and about the things that he has just blessed my life with over and over again.
And Sabbath is so intentional. Yes. Yes. I think that's like what you're leaning to, right? Yeah. I have this spirit within me. I have, yeah. But like I haven't set aside those a 24 hour where it's special holy into the Lord. Yes. Where I'm repeating those things. Yes. So can you, I loved how you shared it with our church a few weeks ago.
Can you give us some examples of the practices that you have found within that Sabbath day? Even tell us when it starts, all those things. Yeah. Like those tips. And I don't wanna say tricks, but I know it's, it is I my Sabbath, it looks a little different than a lot cuz I recently did take on a second job.
It's so funny. I took on that job right as we were starting the Sabbath series. Ah, so let me tell you, that has been the it has almost saved my sanity Sabbath because you're. A difficult schedule sometimes, and so to really consciously practice Sabbath during this time, which all of a sudden got busy for me, I, it's been amazing.
But for me, I have to be a planner around Sabbath and not necessarily the things that I do, but the time. Mm. Because I have to look at about a week or so ahead of time and say, okay, where is that 24 hours gonna be? So typically, like I shared it typically starts on a Wednesday. At 6:00 PM I work 10 hour shifts on my first job.
So I finish Wednesday at six, I have Thursday off, and then pick up again Friday at seven in the morning. So the best part of Sabbath I think for me is I get to share the very first step in Sabbath with my together group. Yeah. Because I go to together group on Wednesday nights, I share the communal meal.
I get to have the, that time with what I would consider family, right? And just enjoy that and then, The activities, or whatever you wanna call it around Sabbath, start on Thursday. And that can, as I shared before, that's recently been more relationally involved. Spending time with my grandchildren, my children, friends, maybe I haven't spoken to in a few months, just get together and hang out and catch up on life and, create that.
Bond that I think I'm gonna need as I go on in life. Just have people around me. Yeah. And that has created more of a social circle for me than I've had in a lot of years, which is wow. That's so good. I'm really proud of the ladies in our church. I think if I can call out the men, they've done a better, you guys have done a better job on the community side.
I've heard different stories from different people and people within our church, like getting together and going to a farmer's market or Yeah, doing a biking class. Just hanging out. Yeah, just hanging out. I think that's anytime we talk about the spiritual disciplines, I think we so naturally think individual personal, shut off from everyone.
And that's sometimes very helpful. But that is such a, that's just a portion of what any discipline is, let alone Sabbath. We had talked about on that fourth week, how do we worship? A big takeaway is you need to have some alone time, right? And you need to have some community. And really plan is you gotta plan that out, right?
You have to plan, but you also have to be flexible. I've found for me that there has to be some flexibility. I'm a planner by nature. That's who I am, and that's what I like. I like it set. But I've also learned over the years, wisdom teaches you those plans may not exactly go away. So you've gotta have some flexibility in there.
And that's been a great part of it too. I may make plans with somebody and they can't make it. Does that mean my Sabbath is ruined? No. That just means God, you and I gotta find something else to do. Yeah. Whether it's, hit up a park and walk, or, call another friend or even if it's just that sitting home alone and listening to some worship music and Yeah.
Doing some, I. Used to be quite creative. I'm trying to get there again, maybe do some things that will bring out that creative side in me again. Yeah, crocheting, right? Yes. I love, it's just so weird. I have turned into my mother. I have turned into her. But it's a, it's just one of those things that I can do with my hands, but yet at the same time, I can think about God, talk to God, and thank him for all these wonderful things.
Sometimes my life overwhelms me. How wonderful I feel like it is, man, that's wonderful. Yeah. That's so rare, yeah. That is not a common what a sign of the Holy Spirit on your life. What a grace. I was gonna say, oh yeah, Jordan for Hersh Watercoloring, yes. Watercolor painting. I have ab.
Thankly. No talent in that. I've tried. Oh, nice. Yeah. But she says it gets her into that rhythm where everything else is blocked out. Yes. And you can just really commune with God. Exactly. For me, mine is biking or kayaking. Yeah. So for me, I like to do something like my whole body is engaged.
And then it just sets my mind free, it's something that where, yeah, my mind doesn't have to be, I'm not taking up space with other things in my brain. Then I can put God in there. Yeah. I love that being planned, but be flexible at the same time because speaking of kayaking, I thought, man, the weather the way it is, I'm gonna kayak for the first time for my Sabbath, which was yesterday.
Yeah. And it didn't work out because I wanted to do the river. And that you can't do alone. Yes. Like literally you can't because like where would you park your vehicle? Cuz you do have to do at the start of the finish and it's just mathematically impossible. There's parts are closed down right now due to the Oh really?
The high levels? Yeah. Cuz it's Oh, the water, the rain. Yeah. The levels and stuff. Yeah. Oh see? Yeah. I don't even think about that. Yeah. There's some places that you can't, they close down some recreational spots. Ah, interesting. Yeah. So I was like, you know what? That's okay. We're just gonna. And and be okay with that and be okay with it.
And I think part of it. I don't have any expectations. I much of my life, I've always, and that's what has gotten me in trouble so much in my life, is here. I expect it to be this way or that way. I have no expectations except that God's gonna be there. That's it. But God's always gonna be there, so that's a given.
Not necessarily an expectation, but I don't have, I don't feel like I'm gonna walk away so much better or so much more of something. If I do, that's great, but if I don't, I've still had time with God. Wow. I've still done that. That's, oh, I love that. And I think that's the heart of worship.
I'm not in control. God, you are. And so if you want to make this feel like it's beneficial, wonderful. If it's not wonderful. And that has been a rub for a lot of our people and for myself it's just fun. Cuz I'm five years into this. And so I, as I'm talking to people, I'm remembering some of the initial resistance.
And that's one of 'em, cuz some of my preaching series was, Hey, this is, this will benefit your body. It will benefit your mind. It will benefit your soul. But it doesn't have to, it's a command, like Exactly. Exactly. So at the end of the day, it still should do it. It's obedience.
Yes, it's obedience. And sometimes that obedience doesn't bring the reward that you think it should bring. It brings maybe a different reward, maybe one down the line maybe never. But it is, there is something in the way I look at it. There's something to be said in being obedient to God, just to be obedient to God.
Yes. It's just he knows so much better. He'll ever know. And he's proven that in my life over and over again. So that may for me come a little easier because. Walked a few more years than some folks. Yeah. You've been broken, right? Oh yeah. We, yeah. That's a story. Expectations have shattered you, right?
Yeah. So you learned, oh, maybe that's not my life story. I don't need to hold on to those. Yeah. We I'm reminded of the parable, Jesus and the servant when he talks about the servant. Waiting to be like rewarded and thanked and it's like you're a servant. You did your job. Yeah. And it's such a funny parable for us, cuz it's what do you mean?
Like I thought God would just be so happy. Something that's no obedience is obedience. Just do it. And that's the reward because you. Did it. You don't need anything on top. Yeah. And if I were to actually, me and Pastor Caleb were talking about right now we're doing the IM statements in the book of Jon.
Yep. Yep. We have one random week before we start our scripture formed by scripture series, which I'm so excited for, to like, how do we dive into the scriptures together in community, which theoretically we do every week anyways, but to really focus on it. But we thought about doing like one more Sabbath sermon, right?
Like a co-teaching. And that's part of these conversations like, oh, obedient. I'm trying to write them down in my brain and just say, Hey, here's what everybody's been saying. Let's celebrate. I think that's all. This isn't the end of a practice. Nope. Like we're really trying to stack, we're trying to stack these things and we think Sabbath is a good one.
I do have a question for you. What is something you will always say no to on Sabbath? Because really Sabbath is a yes day in many ways, but there needs to be a no to something. There absolutely is, and I've got my hard nos and it seems so simple and so easy, and again it is easier for me to say no to this because I do live alone.
There's no housework involved. There's no extra errands involved, and that's because the person that I am, my personality is if I get up. Unload this dishwasher that's gonna lead to washing the counters, washing and sweeping the floors. And then, oh my gosh, the vacuuming is gotta get done. It doesn't end well if it's a Sabbath activity.
And it seems so simple. But that is it. It's those things. So running errands, oh, I'm just gonna run to the store, grab a few things while I'm out, I'm gonna be thinking of other things, that are just I prepare a lot ahead of time. I make sure. That everything is ready so that I'm not doing anything kind of household or chorey at all.
At all. Because I, it just will lead into, this isn't Sabbath, this is a normal Saturday or normal Sunday of what you're gonna do. Yes. And if I don't get to it, I, because I have a, I live in a smaller apartment, kitchen, for example, can look a little messier if you don't get the dishes done right away, right?
It's just a space thing. And there was one Tuesday, I just didn't get to the dishes. I had to work that evening. And in my brain works like, oh my gosh, that it looks so cluttered. That looks so, oh my gosh, you gotta do that. So we'll do it tomorrow. And then in my own little head it said, no, you can't, because if you do start that tomorrow morning or after work, you're not gonna sabbath.
It's gonna, it just. Put my brain in the right place. It needs to be. Yeah. Which needs to be at rest, right? Which needs to be stopped because that's where my work happens, is up in my brain. Yeah. In pastor Caleb and I did have a conversation, like I live up here sometimes there's a lot that goes on, so that needs to be stopped, and if I start a simple activity like that, it turns on my brain again.
It's not gonna get the rest. So your take away was to do it that night? No, I left it. You're okay with I left it being I had to be okay and leave it. I was, yeah, because I didn't get home from work till 10 30 at night and then I gotta get up and work another 10 hours and then No, I'm like, just leave at Lisa.
Yeah, I wanna speak to that. I think it's so good. I think, Sabbath is also a day just to make space for the grace of God, and that's to make space for the power of God. And in all grace, there's been a lot of people from our church. I say I just, I can't is if my house isn't clean. I know. I get that.
Then it's over. Yeah. And so I don't, because I get, I'm a com, I'm a man. I can compartmentalize. It's like cool, I'll just forget that exists and I can move on with life. One thing I have been doing, cuz it is big for Jordan my wife is she, I. I do a lot more around the house lately to make it easier on her.
The few things that she's good at and clean. So it's a team effort, right? And then it's easier on both of us. But it's helpful to remember Hey, Sabbath is about saying, God, I can't, but you can. Yeah, I am weak. You are strong. And so it's saying, God, give me the strength to be okay with that, with those dirty dishes.
And let me just keep giving you glory. It's a great way to say the flesh is weak. It's, but the spirit is strong, so I'm leaning into it. And in those 24 hours that you're gonna give to God, what is that pile of dishes gonna do, Lisa? It's not gonna change that experience in that time that is so precious with God.
Yeah, because you have some dishes. It's dishes in the sink and it's hard. I get it cuz I am living in small spaces for so many years. You. Pretty organized and pretty like together. So it's just hard. It's hard. And even working, cuz my workspace is by my kitchen and I'm working all day looking, working out there.
I couldn't let it go, but I did let it go. I had to, and it was just a conscious effort. You have to just. Even if you have to just talk to yourself out loud. No, I'm not gonna do it. Yeah. That's just not gonna happen. But I also understand the other side of it. I have a daughter with two young kids and working and a husband who works and I can understand the other side of it with I just gotta get this done.
Yeah. Otherwise I'm not gonna enjoy. But also the irony is if you have kids around the house, oh, I just need to clean this. They're gonna mess it up in the middle of Sabbath anyways. Yes. You It's the thing, you when my grandchildren visit, I don't even clean. Yeah. I wait till they go.
Yeah. And they're, when they're at home with mom and dad, they're of cleaning up after them. And I was that way. We, I think we all are. Yeah. But, and now I look at it and go, oh yeah, no, not the best way to do it, guys. Just let 'em mess when they go to sleep big. So I consider you someone who has really embraced Sabbath easier than most.
And I think it's someone, you're someone who yeah. Just seems to have the right perspective on it. And I think also it helps that you've had a few years at least entertaining the idea. Yeah. I know. We've never been so focused on it until this year, but at least we've been talking about it a little bit, but what are some of your struggles and frustrations now with Sabbath that maybe you didn't have when you started it?
Wow, that's a, are there new dimensions? Oh, there's another layer that I'm hitting here. That was, it was easier when I started and now this part is tough, right? I think it's the, what to do is getting tougher because like I do, I spend time with friends, but I, I. Don't expect, that's always gonna be the way it is.
And to not let my brain get to that place where, okay, next week, this is what we have to do. Instead of spending time with the kids, you're gonna go do A, B, and C. It's and not letting myself slide back into that pattern of, if I don't have a place to go or something to do, let's just throw on Netflix for, yeah.
12 hours or how, whatever. It's just being very aware that. It could be very, I could easily go back to where I was and then if that starts to stop myself and say, okay, so a great example is this week everybody's busy. So what do I do for my Sabbath this week? It's for me it's gonna be get out. I wanna go check out some of the super bloom we're having out here in Arizona and just be out there, be in God's creation. I'm not a super hiker, obviously. I'm not the most, I'm not gonna hike up the side of a mountain, but I can certainly walk through, the botanical gardens or something and just enjoy and be part of it.
But initially it was, oh, if you don't have anything to do, then you don't have to Sabbath. No, Lisa, you have to Sabbath. And I have to say, This is just another little push for Sabbath. Since getting a second job and getting so busy, it has really having intentionally, putting aside that time has made having a second job so much easier for me.
It really has. You would think I'm going crazy and I'm so busy. My second job is very opposite of what I do for my primary job. So that's helpful. Yeah, very helpful. It gets me outta the house. I'm around people. I told you I work in, I know. I still visit Greg. My, the kids came last night, but, oh, fun.
It is so much fun to be there and to be around people that sometimes I even think, wow, this is almost a Sabbath activity for me as well, because Totally. It's not, it's work, but it's not work for that production value, right? It's, I'm enjoying, I'm laugh. I'm just, I have such a good time.
It's so big. That's awesome. And it's like, it's all the the little ladies like me walking around the store up stuff. It's so much fun and it's been so enjoyable. But I also know that I think if I stopped Sabbath, if I missed it, It would then tend to become hard for me. It would then be like, oh gosh, I gotta go to this second place.
It would be less enjoyable. I really believe that, because I believe that when you talked about, I can't remember which sermon it was about. Are you physically tired, mentally tired, emotionally tired? If I didn't have Sabbath, I would be physically exhausted. Because it's 20 hours a week there, 40 hours a week there.
That's a lot of work. haven't, ever since I've started Sabbath thing, I have not felt physically exhausted once working two jobs. Wow. And that amazes me yeah, like I should be tired. You, that amazes me too. Like I should be a little bit tired. I sleep better. Definitely. Nice. Yeah. But yeah, I, that's, like that Sabbath principle I think you're communicating to is you.
When you begin your Sabbath, then those next three days you're operating from rest. Yeah. And then the three days after that, you're operating in anticipation for the next rest. I have. Yes. So there's a joy it in all six days of the week. Absolutely. I always start thinking, okay, what am I gonna do in my next sab?
What do we got here? Yeah. It is, it's been, yeah it's helped me thrive, I think, a lot more too, just to be, able to spend that time with God as in, in such a more focused way than I think I've ever done. That's good. How has the practice of Sabbath changed your view of God if any yeah.
I remember you said your vision of God will shape your version of Sabbath, right? Yeah. And I never thought of God as a task master. But I was, that person always thought, maybe I disappointed you, God, and. Um, I was doing things to make up for that, and that Sabbath has definitely changed that perspective.
He, it I don't disappoint. He understands this heart is trying and it's working and it's not in the, but working towards, getting just be becoming closer to him and getting better at that relationship with him cuz that's never been my strong suit relationships with anybody. But it really changed my mindset of I'm not a disappointment to him.
Come on, I'm not doing that because he's disappointed in me. I'm doing that. Of my own flaws and wounds and failures. These are why I'm doing these. The way I'm doing them. God loves me. God wants me to thrive. He wants me to be, to feel loved, validated and needed, and He has given me all that through this time.
It's just I wish I could articulate it better. I really do. It is such a special time for me because I get to just focus on God, and it took a while to get. Took five years or four years, right? Yeah. Yeah. 2019 to 2023. But I, but getting there, it was the best thing I think I've done. Especially at this phase of life where, it's just me.
I was starting to feel like, what's next? What do I do? Where do I go? What's my purpose? And the biggest thing I think I found out recently is it's not necessarily a purpose, Lisa. You just need to be, you just need to be with me. Meaning him. Yeah. Presence. Yeah. That's so good. I think that's such a word, like what you just said too.
We could unpack for hours, but I'm sorry I No that was wonderful. Like our vision of God's love for us, we're bringing in our own wounds and failures. You had said yes. And so Sabbath is such a great opportunity just to lay that at the feet of Jesus and go, you love me, no matter. And no matter what.
And in fact, you were wounded for my wounds, so I just love that. I think that's a great, we we don't recognize how much our wounds contribute to our life. You're right. And so we like to say our wo our woundedness and wickedness keeps us from full deliverance.
And I think growing up in a church context, my assumption is always wickedness. But we also have, by the power of the Holy Spirit, a regenerated heart. So sometimes the things we're. At the core is not wicked. It's from a wound. It's from a wicked. And so now we are wounding others. Yes. This doesn't excuse sin in any sense, but I think it is helpful to pinpoint why am I doing what I'm doing?
Yeah. And Sabbath is a bomb to the soul. It is. And it. It helps heal those wounds. I think I really feel like it does if you spend that time focused. And even if it, I mean I obviously, some of my Sabbath time is always spent in prayer and scripture and just finding that time to, like you said, later his feet and say, can you heal this for me?
Because it's still there. I can't believe all these years later it's still there, but. Yeah. Yeah. I I'm now reading fiction on Sabbath. Ooh. I'm trying and it's really been hard for me. Very hard. And so do you relate to that too? I know there's someone at church that says they hate fiction. Do you like fiction though?
I do like fiction. Okay. It was the non-fiction. You're the one that got me done. The nonfic. Got it. Should I struggle with that? So I'm reading a book called glittering Image. And I actually was in tears yesterday. Yeah. On my Sabbath, reading a fiction book. I'm like, who am I? But it was about the wounds.
It's actually about this this pastor, who is I say pastor. He's it's Anglican Church. So it's all those different titles. Yeah. Early 19 hundreds in England. So it's fun setting, historical. Historical fiction. Yes. I love that. But then it's all about this archbishop who feels threatened by this other guy.
So he sends his scholar theologian to go figure out if there's any dirt. Oh, so there's so much. It's wonderful, right? It's suspense. But what's fun about it is you think this whole time, this guy's the bad guy. The guy, they're interrogating. But it actually opens up the wounds of the investigator. Wow. And then all of a sudden he's I'm the problem.
And so it starts to just dive into, yeah. Like the idolatry every pastor has of putting on a front and being loved by their performance or how successful they are and Wow. All this stuff. And like then it was just torn apart. I'm just like, this is such a good, and I'm like, it's all biblical stuff, but in the form of a.
And just my soul needed that. Just a different version versus here's the facts, now here's how it plays out. If you don't address your wounds Yes. In 30 years here's what could happen. This is what it looks like. I'm just kidding. Yeah, no, exactly. It really does though. But you, if if I had done this younger, and that's one of the things that I thought about recently too.
I and I don't live in regrets or anything like that, but I do wish. 20 years ago, 30 years ago, I had started practicing this because I think I would've been my wounds and just my life would have been. So much easier, than I allowed it to be because his yoke is easy and for life.
It's just, I just, I, so I think, I often think of all the young families we have at Passion Creek and I'm like, go for it. People do it. Cuz if you're doing it now, when you're hitting my stage of life, oh you're good. You're, it's just gonna be that much more delightful to have Sabbath when you've even, it's just a, yeah, that's such a good word, because, the natural inc inclination with our people, our younger people are like, I'll do this when I'm retired.
I'll do this when I'm in my don't fifties, sixties. And it's like, no. Every so many things in the Christian faith today is the day, today is the day of salvation. And that can mean actual salvation. But salvation also has that salve, the healing Yeah. Element to it.
And it's like today's the day for healing. You don't need to put off. Change your mind, change your ways today. Me, NOA, repent today. And there's so much on offer. One of the biggest lies of the enemy is, yeah, that's right. Just don't do it yet. Yeah. Yes. Oh Lord. He had that one in my ear for many years. Yeah.
And then when you do it, oh, this is right. But you're doing it wrong. Yeah, that's another lie. Yes. That's another one. Absolutely. Yes. And that's probably where I. What am I hate to say how old I was. Let's just, I don't hate to say it. Let's see. Probably in my early walk, which was about, it's been about 20 years now.
Yeah. You're doing it right. You're doing it, but you're doing it wrong. And then there's that. Then I'm just gonna give up. I'm, if I'm can't do it right, then I'm gonna give up. It is a struggle for many years. Yeah. Yeah. It's just the lie of the enemy. So he's last question. Okay. This has been wonderful.
What tips, encouragement, advice would you give someone who's interested in Sabbath but hasn't even begun practicing it yet? Wow. So I would definitely say don't, again, back to the expectations, right? If you're putting in your head, I've gotta do this, I have to do this for say, 24 hours.
If you don't hit the 24 hours, that's okay. Maybe plan for 12 hours. Let's start small foundational. I'm a baby stepper. That's how I teach folks. Let's take this first baby step. If it's a 12 hour Sabbath, let it be 12 hours. That's that training idea of Yeah. App apprenticeship to Jesus is helpful to me.
Hey, it's a marathon. Yes. But tomorrow just get off the couch. Do not, yeah. And then do not. Like you end your, say you do the 24 hours and you end that 24 hours, don't expect immediately the whole world's going to look and be different, right? God does take time to form us, to shape us, to make these things work in our lives.
So time is important. So in my brain it always goes back to expectations. Don't set them so high. Give yourself grace, give I, I know when we first started in two 19, I really did start with a 12 hour one. It. I just didn't feel like I needed 24 hours, but I would try and don't give up.
Just don't give up just do not let anything stop you if it didn't work out this week. Okay, let's try again. There's a new whiteboard over there that you can erase and write on again and say, we're gonna start over again. And a plan, I've, like I've said, a. With flexibility, but plan, have something in your head that this is what we're gonna do for Sabbath.
Kinda like some guardrails. Yeah. Like we have a lot of room to play. Yes. But here's a few things. Yeah. Know what you can't do. Yeah. Know what you can't do. Like I said, housework don't if you can avoid all that stuff do, but just know what you can't do. What's gonna take you away from that. And that's, That's about all I got cuz it's just me.
So it's easy for me to do all those things. Yeah, no, I love that. I think also, just one more thought I had just on that thought. Do it even though there isn't a reward. What Christ is trying to do within us is to change our narrative of what is the purpose of life? The meaning of life. And I think a meaning of life that many of us as Americans adopt is to maximize pleasure and minimize pain.
And in many ways, Sabbath is perfect cuz it's oh, you're telling me about a life where I can maximize pleasure and minimize. So I think when we think that's the whole purpose, then if we do a few sabbaths down the road and my pleasure hasn't increased. Yeah, my pain hasn't decreased, I'm out.
And it's no, the purpose is actually holiness. Transforming into his image. Yes. Changing your character or living a life of gratitude and delight in God. There's so many other purposes. There are. There may be a lot of pleasure down the road. I think there really is, but not when it's the main.
Yeah, I think the pleasure comes from the delight. Like when you start Sabbath thing and you make that a habit, that delight then becomes habitual. I feel like, I know it's the simple things. I take the dog out at six o'clock in the morning, hear the birds sing these days. I'm like, oh wow.
That's really good. Yeah. It's the tiniest little things that have captured me recently, and it's because I've taken the time. Previously to delight in all that and and now it's just, it's a muscle, right? Yeah. Yeah. And when you don't do it, so we did day inu. We've been doing day inu at dinner, right?
Especially with friends over, we go, okay, like we're all, we just had dinner together. Let's now do day inu, which is it would've been enough if, we just had this, but God outdid himself and now we also have that. And people always are be like, this is so weird. This is so hard. I thought I was a grateful person.
I can't think of anything. And I'm like, that's okay. You've never done this before. What do you expect? It's like walking for the first time. You're not gonna start running right. And so good. This means you need it. And it means you need repetition. Don't judge yourself yet. Just keep going and going. And you'll be surprised in a year from now how creative you can get with day inu.
Yeah, and I'm not the most self-disciplined person in the world either, so take my example and, know that it will get there, but you just gotta keep at it. You do may have to incorporate some self-discipline into your life. And that's what I've had to do. Which has been a bit of a struggle, but it, in the end, it was worth every bit of that struggle oh, it's.
I wish I had better words sometimes to articulate what it has done in my life. Cuz it's been an amazing few weeks, a couple months now, right? Yeah. That we've been doing it. It's, yeah, it's been, he even lost track of time. It feels like I've been doing it forever. I love it. No, I really think the spirit of God is, Totally using your words, so don't feel like they're falling short.
I know my affections are stirred for the Lord and I'm excited to Sabbath, which is in six days. Hurry up, let's get back to the Sabbath. So anyways, thank you so much for joining. Anytime. Hope you're willing to come back again. You have to drive pretty far. Yeah. But to do this dog goes right up the road.
Oh good. It makes it worth the trip win. Good. Awesome. Grace and peace to you and thank you for everybody who's been listening. Yes. We hope that you guys are encouraged and yeah, this has great fun combo. Yeah. Fun convo.